Focus On Korea: T3's Kim Talks Hitmaking With Audition

Author: by Brandon Sheffield, Leigh Alexander

With the rise of microtransactions and MapleStory, South Korean gaming has been growing in respect and relevance in the west. There's a lot to learn from this rich, constantly evolving market, which grew up along lines so different from the U.S., Japan and Europe that it's difficult to compare -- and compete with. To that end, Gamasutra has compiled five complete interviews with a variety of members of top companies in the market, conducted principally at the annual Gstar trade show, to offer their perspective on the industry in 2007 and going forward. This time, Gamasutra speaks to Yoo-Ra Kim, CMO and director of T3, developer of Audition, the dance and music game that has become an Asian sensation. Enduring ongoing popularity since its launch three years ago, Kim's perspective on sustaining and following a successful franchise is somewhat different than in the U.S., especially with the prevalence of online PC and arcade gaming in Asia versus consoles. Can you talk about the company's history, first off? Yoo-Ra Kim: T3 was established in 2000. As other companies did, we also started with a PC singing game. In 2002, we changed our business sector to online, because as you probably know, there are a lot of illegal copies in Korea. We couldn't make any profit from the game, so we decided to change our business sector. Then we made three or four types of different casual online games at the time. In 2003, we faced financial difficulty, so we had to choose one of them. That was Audition. So we just focused on developing Audition, because it's not a blockbuster huge game, but we were sure that it has a unique point to appeal in the market, so we decided to keep going. Finally, we made it. Since we launched in 2004, Audition has more than 300 million registered accounts worldwide. Especially in China, where we have 800,000 concurrent users. Worldwide, there are more than one million concurrent users. So China is the biggest market? YK: Yes. Why do you think that is? YK: I don't know exactly. People said it was Korea's actors, actresses, movie, [TV] drama, [became] popular, and in China, exactly the same things happened. Audition has fashion and dress, and music, and dancing -- current, up-to-date dancing. These three types of things, plus community things. We created a lot of gamers not from another game, but non-gamers. As you know, the game market is dominated by male users -- like 90 or 80 percent. But in Audition's case, it showed fifty-fifty. So we created a lot of female users from this market. That's one of our big issues when we do Audition research. It is true that in many of the countries we've launched so far, it's so successful, especially when we put the marketing with a media company, like a broadcasting company, and a lot of media [types]. Radio stations, TV channels -- things like that. Then the power became really huge. A funny story in Vietnam is a report that's known as Small China. Now, Auditionis the number one casual game in Vietnam. Our partner, VTC, never operated an online game before. Audition was their first time. But they had five TV channels. So they're the only one and the very first [game that] appeared on a TV show in Vietnam for the first time. Also they did some kind of music audition competition, so a lot of their users pick very cute and beautiful users on TV. The audience is there, and it was on TV nationwide, so it became an annual festival. This year, also, they did this audition in Ho Chi Minh city. That's impressive. How did you decide to choose that partner? Obviously it worked out really well, but it's surprising if they've never operated a game before. YK: The first thing is that when we were so small in Korea, we couldn't find any proper partner in Korea at the time, in 2004. What I decided was, "Okay, let's do some TV shows." So we met some game TV people, and I suggested, "Why don't you guys make a TV show with Audition?" So far, game TV was shooting or killing monsters, or fighting, or racing, or sports, or something like that, but never had there been a dancing game on TV. Once it appeared, people would just see what it is. People got a lot of curiosity, and since we started a TV show in Korea, our concurrent users became double. When we did three months, it became thousands, thousands, thousands. So I thought it's kind of a mixture of media [beyond games]. Not just simple games -- game business. So now, we have a regular TV show, where we invite celebrities on TV, so they're talking about gossip things and their current views and they are bringing their new album, if they are singers. So they just introduce, and with Audition users, they play the game, on TV. So it gives another [way of having] fun, you know? Because certain singers have a lot of fans. That's how we created the market in domestic and overseas, and so far, that's why I think Audition became one unique specific genre in the market. Now Audition is on PSP. YK: And arcade machines. Yeah, and arcade. So you've got it in multiple game media right now. Why did you decide to do that? YK: We wanted to show in the market that we're not only just using the online game section, but also if something is happening in the market, we just want to make a variety of business. So the PSP was kind of challenging. We didn't expect a profit from the title's release -- just 10,000, or something like that. It's not that much. But it was a very good try for us, and once the company made certain general games, people just say, "Oh, how long is this game's lifecycle?" or something. But if the lifecycle is going to be longer and longer, then we need to do something, not only online as it is, but in many different related sectors. That's why we decided to make Audition musical, and Audition arcade machines, and Audition for PSP, and later, we could make Audition for the PlayStation 3 or Xbox or something like that. Do you have any plans for any of that yet? YK: If the Xbox people suggested us a very good condition, then we'd love to. That's one of our goals to achieve -- not just the online section, but we want to broaden our brand. Did you also make the PSP version in order to gain some experience making a full, shelf release product? YK: Regarding PC games, we already have a lot of experience making finished products in the market. Well, you made the offline PC game, right? YK: We started with that, but compared with the online business sector, it's too small. And these days with USB, people can do everything. They can put movies and games and everything inside. If that is 4 gigabytes or something, you can do whatever. So I guess that's not the answer, but indeed, it seems like... well, there's no quality control or specific console parameters you have to deal with in PC, so that was what I was wondering. But the answer seems to be no. YK: For now, the European market is dominated by the console game market still. Now, we have a London office, and are operating Audition there alone. We're struggling. Two weeks ago, I had an interview with the BBC, and they're asking, "What is an online game?" or something. And I answered, "These blahblahblah things." One thing difficult for us also is to educate them about what is the real enjoyment of an online game. It's really tough, because unless government policy supports the broadband system as a private company, it's really difficult to achieve this kind of goal. The reason we became popular here is because the base structure was so good. When you download a certain game's client, it just takes five minutes or something. When you try in the UK, it's four hours or something like that. People get noisy, and they just give up. What I've done while I was in the UK was meeting online PC game and console game distributors in the UK. What they are doing was... he's an ex-Infogrames director, and that's why he has very good knowledge about both online and offline marketing. He agreed that Audition has really good potential, so somehow we'll do some free download from their sites. Then we will make Audition packaging that looks like a DVD case, which will have the client and some special item like clothes, and some special present inside. We'll make it very fancy, so it looks like a console game, but as it is, it's online. We test all things like that for the local market, but we can distribute them, so we can create UK users easily, because they don't need to download from the website. Is the arcade business in Korea still good enough that you can make a profit off of that? YK: As far as I know, the arcade market size became really small, compared to years ago. But what we believe is that Audition is something different. It's not gambling, it just [relieves your stress] when you play the game. People have some kind of reminiscence about the DDR thing. It happened five years ago. What they did was they didn't do any update. What we can do is we can do regular updates on the song side, dancing side, and the featuring and outfits. One more good thing is that Audition is now worldwide. We have millions of users. So yesterday and today, I already got some orders from our partner company, and some in Indonesia and in India, and Japan. For the arcade version? YK: Yes, arcade versions. So the arcade machine will be networked? YK: Now, you play with NPCs, or you can compete with one person versus one person -- two-person multiplayer. But we put a computer inside, so what we can do later is also do some network play. But the arcade is offline, so it's kind of a different fun. You don't play an hour or two hours on the arcade machines -- just five or ten minutes. You just have some fun, and that's it. What we can do is we have scratch cards, so when you have a point, you can use the point in your online site. It's that sort of consolidation. When you said you could update frequently, can you update remotely, or do you have to install it? YK: Of course, we need to put some guys in there -- engineers. But it's very simple work with CDs or USB. We can simply do that, like what we did with online updates. It's exactly the same. Did you also make the PSP version in order to gain some experience making a full, shelf release product? YK: Regarding PC games, we already have a lot of experience making finished products in the market. Well, you made the offline PC game, right? YK: We started with that, but compared with the online business sector, it's too small. And these days with USB, people can do everything. They can put movies and games and everything inside. If that is 4 gigabytes or something, you can do whatever. So I guess that's not the answer, but indeed, it seems like... well, there's no quality control or specific console parameters you have to deal with in PC, so that was what I was wondering. But the answer seems to be no. YK: For now, the European market is dominated by the console game market still. Now, we have a London office, and are operating Audition there alone. We're struggling. Two weeks ago, I had an interview with the BBC, and they're asking, "What is an online game?" or something. And I answered, "These blahblahblah things." One thing difficult for us also is to educate them about what is the real enjoyment of an online game. It's really tough, because unless government policy supports the broadband system as a private company, it's really difficult to achieve this kind of goal. The reason we became popular here is because the base structure was so good. When you download a certain game's client, it just takes five minutes or something. When you try in the UK, it's four hours or something like that. People get noisy, and they just give up. What I've done while I was in the UK was meeting online PC game and console game distributors in the UK. What they are doing was... he's an ex-Infogrames director, and that's why he has very good knowledge about both online and offline marketing. He agreed that Audition has really good potential, so somehow we'll do some free download from their sites. Then we will make Audition packaging that looks like a DVD case, which will have the client and some special item like clothes, and some special present inside. We'll make it very fancy, so it looks like a console game, but as it is, it's online. We test all things like that for the local market, but we can distribute them, so we can create UK users easily, because they don't need to download from the website. Is the arcade business in Korea still good enough that you can make a profit off of that? YK: As far as I know, the arcade market size became really small, compared to years ago. But what we believe is that Audition is something different. It's not gambling, it just [relieves your stress] when you play the game. People have some kind of reminiscence about the DDR thing. It happened five years ago. What they did was they didn't do any update. What we can do is we can do regular updates on the song side, dancing side, and the featuring and outfits. One more good thing is that Audition is now worldwide. We have millions of users. So yesterday and today, I already got some orders from our partner company, and some in Indonesia and in India, and Japan. For the arcade version? YK: Yes, arcade versions. So the arcade machine will be networked? YK: Now, you play with NPCs, or you can compete with one person versus one person -- two-person multiplayer. But we put a computer inside, so what we can do later is also do some network play. But the arcade is offline, so it's kind of a different fun. You don't play an hour or two hours on the arcade machines -- just five or ten minutes. You just have some fun, and that's it. What we can do is we have scratch cards, so when you have a point, you can use the point in your online site. It's that sort of consolidation. When you said you could update frequently, can you update remotely, or do you have to install it? YK: Of course, we need to put some guys in there -- engineers. But it's very simple work with CDs or USB. We can simply do that, like what we did with online updates. It's exactly the same. What is your perception of the console market in Korea right now? YK: Console? The Sony people and Microsoft people are thinking about, "What is this Korean market?" because they were so successful in the European market, [as well as] the U.S. But in Asia and Korea, not that much. What I'm thinking is that somehow, we need some sort of connection between console and online. Online's fun element is never-ending. It's long-lasting. But on console, when you buy certain packaging, if you have one week's enjoyment, that's it. People feel, "Oh, that's enough." But for online games, even if you play one week or two weeks and then if you feel, "Oh, I'm sick of this," you just quit. So for us, the homework is how we make them never bored. That's our issue. If we somehow make a cool product with consoles, then if they want console fun -- very simple fun -- then we just give it to the console side. But if they want some communication, we put that element into the online side. Both sides, if they can co-work, like in the engine side, then I think the market will be really huge. Otherwise, I think console in Korea will be really tough. Microsoft does have their Games for Windows Live, so people can play on their PC against people on the 360. It seems like that might be the kind of thing that could... YK: The one difficult thing for the console market is that people need to buy hardware, which is very expensive. If we could put that function in a screen, in an Internet cafe or a house or wherever, people would see the screen and then [just play.] Boxing, you and I, we can do it. I was really enjoying Nintendo's [Wii] boxing game currently. I said, "Oh my God, if we can make this online in an Internet cafe, it would be really good for us!" Or golf, or whatever they can do. That's maybe the next level of game. In the current timeframe, do you have any interest in making games for the Wii or stuff like that? YK: The Nintendo Wii? We are very flexible, so unless they suggest too tough of conditions, we'd really love to do it. Some of our titles really fit for the Nintendo Wii. They really fit. Luckily, yesterday, I met a Nintendo guy from here. He was interested in one of our titles, and next year, we're going to have a meeting. Soon, I can show you another Nintendo version! It seems like with the success of Audition Online, other companies are trying to create online rhythm games. YK: Yes, like dancing games. Do you think the market is going to get more crowded because of your success? YK: There are already five or six dancing games in the market. On one side, we're very happy, because the market size became very big, and also they believe, "Oh, we can also create another market for dancing or the rhythm game genre." Another thing is I think they just try too simple of an idea. Audition is already three years old. For the last three years, we've experienced a lot of ups and downs, which means that with Audition, we've put many, many things in it. If they don't make comparative quality to Audition, they will fail, easily. That's my concern. Also, once in the market, one very huge dancing game is coming out, then our inside team might be nervous, and they will show more passion for the Audition project. My hope is that in the market the dancing genre will become bigger and bigger, because dancing and singing -- these kinds of action are universal activities which never get boring. If we just keep changing the type of music and dancing and those sorts of things, then people will enjoy this game forever. It seems a lot of people are not really trying to develop their own original ideas. YK: Yeah. They're copying. Yeah, there's a lot of that happening. YK: If I see Audition now, three years before, Audition was totally different. If I see three years before the [current] game... "Oh, it sucks!" or something. It's too simple, or something. But now, we have many types of game modes. We have sports dance, salsa, hip-hop, disco, a lot of '70s and '80s dancing... many types. If you know, what is the most popular form of dancing on Audition? YK: Choreography. They want to be backup dancers, or a team. The second one is freestyle. That is, they can create choreography as they want. The choreography mode is... we already put the system in, so once they press certain buttons, everybody does the same dancing. But in freestyle, if I'm a master, I can give you all kinds of recipes. "So you guys, let's do this in order," and they play their own choreography. One good thing about Audition is that once you've played a game, you can record it, so you can see your replay. They're just, "Oh my God, I did it!" or some kind of achievement. Can you talk about the other projects you have going right now? YK: Milman 2 is on the booth there. That's actually our first online game. But the sad story was that even though we developed it before Audition, at that time, our programmers' quality was not that good. Their game design was very unique, funny, and simple, but technically, it needed support. So as I said, we had several titles to develop, and we had to choose one. At the time, we decided to give up Milman. Last year, we started to develop the game with a very good team, and now we are ready to release it. The reaction of users is quite good now. So since you got enough money from Audition, you're able to do the other games you wanted to do? YK: Yeah. You know what? While we were developing Audition, we also had many different types of game scenarios, but at the time we didn't have money. Now we have cash, so now it's like, "Let's do it!" (laughs) Is T3 still independent, or has someone tried to purchase you yet? YK: No. We're independent. Are you going to stay that way? YK: It might be changing. We might be going public. That's different from getting bought. That's probably better, actually. YK: Maybe in the U.S., hopefully. I need to say "no comment" about that. That's my duty. Aside from things you can't talk about, what is next for T3? YK: We have ten more pipelines. Ten? Wow. YK: We have 370 developers now. That's quite impressive. So ten separate teams? YK: Yes. We have 80 members in Shanghai. They're all in graphic design. Is everyone else in Korea? All the rest of the developers? YK: Yes. And two are in London! (laughs) So they are making ten different types of games. It's all very different -- a very new genre of FPS, and a new genre of strategy, and role-playing, and some simple and mixed ones. Sports, as well. It sounds like you're taking some risks now. YK: Yes, because I'm not God, so I'm not sure which one will be a hit. For Audition, I also didn't expect this much success. So who knows? We're preparing for the future. I think each game has unique points, so each team will be competing with each other. We'll see who will be the winner. It seems like a good idea to try and do a lot of different ideas at the same time. Then you can actually experiment and see what works. Not a lot of people seem to want to try to do different things right now. YK: Yes, [doing too many] different things [is] too tough. So slightly different and slightly unique... people can feel sort of cozy with it. If it's too different, they don't even try, because it's too tough to learn. It's good that you're doing that, because when most companies become big, they become like, "Okay, now we have to be really safe. We have to make sure each game is a hit every time." YK: It's not possible. Yeah. It's a bad way to do business, I think, because you're just making your market smaller and smaller that way. YK: Yeah. We saw some of our seniors who did big successes, but later on, now they are struggling. We won't make that kind of mistake again. Yeah. I've seen a lot of that, especially in this market. It's happened many times. YK: And also many people are young. The good thing about our company is that our senior has a big dream. He's not only a game graphic designer or programmer, he's kind of management side. So he's drawing a big forest, not just a tree. That's a good thing for our company's future, I think. [For many more insights into this vibrant and unique territory for gaming, the full transcripts of these interviews are now available on Gamasutra.]